All The Trigger Warnings

All of them. Rape, consent – all the trigger warnings. I don’t want to hurt anyone and I’ve been accused of doing that a lot lately so just – consider this your all encompassing trigger warning.

I have a question brought up by a show I’m watching. 

Do you think if a girl is really drunk, and doesn’t remember a night, and has sex but doesn’t remember it, that it’s rape? That if the guy has sex with her but she’s too drunk to consent, that it is rape? Is drunk sex just another equivalent of rape?
Or is it just two people having a thing.

Can a man really be held responsible for being drunk even if he’s 100lbs more than the girl and just as drunk or even if she consents but is drunk? 

What is consent? How does consent with alcohol work? 

I don’t know. And I am not sure I want to. 

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22 thoughts on “All The Trigger Warnings

  1. I have rarely heard of a man being so drunk that he does not remember all the events of the night before. I have frequently heard of women being drunk and passing out and not recalling how they even got there. I will always be on the side of the woman who is drunk if someone had sex with her. I don’t care how drunk the man is. If a woman is intoxicated and passed out or so drunk that her brain is obviously mush then she cannot give consent and should not have to. NO ONE NEEDS TO BE HAVING SEX WITH A WOMAN UNLESS SHE IS COMPLETELY SOBER. Those are my feelings on that.

    Liked by 1 person

    • You know what’s interesting is my husband agrees with you. Even now, as my husband, if he or I have had ANY drink, we don’t have sex. It has always been that way. From dating until now. And I never questioned it or wondered why. I should ask him if that’s the reason.

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      • I hear a lot of stories since my husband is a detective and I have strong feelings about it. My husband does not drink at all. Not one sip of alcohol. And he knows of my experiences, reads my blogs, and he has allowed me to heal because of his constant understanding and never pressure

        Liked by 1 person

  2. I’ve copied this from a forum I used to post on. It includes a few swear words… but it is what I refer to whenever I am convincing myself that maybe I consented.
    Consent is:
    Non-coercive: If you’re cojoling, threatening or otherwise trying to “convince” someone to engage in a sexual act with you, you are breaking consent. If you asked 16 times and got 15 No’s and 1 Yes, you still did not adequately obtain consent. Also, you’re a weak individual.

    Not fixed: What I mean by this is you shouldn’t take for granted that after asking once for consent that you now have consent forever. It’s not like landing a gig as a Supreme Court judge. You don’t have consent for life. It should be continuously negotiated.

    Dynamic: Related to the above note, consent for one act does not necessitate consent for all acts. Consent is not an EZ Pass. It should be re-addressed constantly for different acts.

    Conscious: Yeah, I want to believe I don’t have to explain this one. Bad enough I had to list it. But ok, yes, an inebriated/asleep/passed out or otherwise not fully coherent person cannot consent. There, you can’t say no one ever told you.

    Unambiguous/Explicit: Assume all of the following to mean “no.” — “Maybe,” “I’m not sure,” “Not yet,” “Kinda,” “Wait a minute,” …I could go on.

    Not contingent upon sexual interest nor sexual arousal: We know. Blue balls are a motherfuc*er. Still no excuse. Neither your NOR the expressed/implied interest of any potential partners is an invitation to any act. Also, neither your nor the (assumed) arousal of anyone you might want to have sex with is an invitation. Yes, someone might be aroused and still not want to fuck. Crazy times. I know.

    Not compensatory: Yeah, that dinner and a movie were nice. Still not an invitation to fuck. And if you thought it was, you’re a world class asshole.

    Not something that requires a qualifier: No one needs to explain why they are not granting you consent. No is enough.

    Age appropriate: Much like the point on being Conscious that shouldn’t have had to be explained, I’m appalled that this needs to be included either but here goes. If someone is under the age of consent, and/or is too young to understand what consent or even sex IS, um…the answer is automatically NO. Go find someone your own age you pedophiles.

    Not Past-Reliant: So someone was abused before and trusted you enough to open up to you about such personal information? Do yourself a favor and don’t BREAK that trust. Just because a person was abused in the past (which they obviously didn’t consent to THEN or it wouldn’t be called “abuse”) does not mean that you can take advantage of them. Which, in layman’s terms means: Abuse is abuse, then or now. It is NOT consent!

    Liked by 2 people

  3. Oh and finally… okay, trigger warning, but by this point anyone who reads your blog (or mine, or many people on here’s) should know that there are possible triggers. I’m going to put a banner on top of my blog saying just that. You don’t need to trigger warning every single thing in every single post. This blog is for you. Do we want to help out others? Of course. But writing for yourself is supposed to be cathartic, not, “oh no, did I trigger someone?”
    We are adults on here. I know in recent weeks that I’d be triggered by WP so I’ve mainly stayed off of it. Look what Rachel did – she left! This is all to say that I support you putting a general warning at the top of your blog and then not worrying about it. Obviously this is at your discretion but you have enough to worry about without worrying about who you’re hurting. There is a knowledge in our community of what topics we write about. If it’s too much to handle at the moment, we can stay away.
    It just rubs me the wrong way that people have been accusing you of hurting them. That’s just not fair. This is your blog. If you give them a general warning, then it’s on them (and you don’t have to spend time trying to warn away / caveat each and every post). There may be exceptions, at your discretion… Sorry, just my (strong) opinion…

    Liked by 2 people

    • It’s okay. It actually isn’t people here but on a Facebook group that I am a part of. Someone accused me the other day of having no idea how social media can be triggering. There’s an argument over a policy, and I was trying to discuss it neutrally, and ended up getting insulted and told my posts are triggering and I should be censoring myself if it could cause someone harm.

      I should have clarified that it wasn’t anyone here. It just drives me nuts that something I posted (asking for a hairdresser recommendation, by the way, literally it) then got just absolutely ripped on by people who accused me of having no idea what could trigger people.

      It’s like, fuck off, you don’t know me (them, not you, obviously)

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      • Sheesh. In that case, as far as little things like that, what are they going to do when someone asks them for a hairdresser recommendation in person? Do they not understand that life in general can be triggering and to some extent we must learn to deal with it? Maybe that sounds harsh and I don’t understand their story but that makes opening your mouth about normal things walking on eggshells… ugh…

        Liked by 1 person

      • (Oh and again, if social media is triggering to them, then why are they on it – at least until they work through that with their therapist? They have plenty of ability to avoid social media if they find it harmful. Okay, I promise, rant over this time!)

        Liked by 1 person

      • I could rant for days with you here. They are arguing for body neutrality, no posts about bodies ever. And I’m arguing that it’s impossible to separate ourselves from our bodies.

        I’m also not responsible for your self regulation. If I have to figure out how to get through my days, you figure out how to get through yours.

        I think that’s the part that makes me the most mad.

        Liked by 1 person

  4. We’ve gone through a lot of consent training at my university lately. They say that it is impossible to give consent while drunk, due to the state of the mind, just as it is impossible to give consent while under age (I.e. You can consent but you might not be totally clear on the decision in an adult-thinking way, which means you really can’t consent). That might not encompass a lot of nuances, obviously, but I think that’s a pretty good rule of thumb that applies for both men and women in all sorts of relationships.

    Liked by 2 people

    • (And to be clear, in many cases, that means drunk sex is rape, pure and simple. It doesn’t matter if the person who is raping was drunk too, although that can make thinks trickier legally Title IX wise, although not sure that you have that in Canada…)

      Liked by 1 person

      • We don’t have Title IX in Canada. I suppose where I get stuck is if both parties don’t remember what happened and nobody was around to see it, then what?

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  5. Well, while reading the question, my first gut reaction was that of “yes, it is rape”. Especially if the girl is too drunk to give consent.

    On second thought, I’d ponder how drunk the guy is, or both parties, as well. Are they aware of what they’re doing, is the guy semi-conscious, is the guy under some mind-altering hypnotic-drunk hyper-aggressive state? It depends, so like if the guy is aware of what he’s doing, it’s obviously rape, but if the guy’s judgement is impaired and doesn’t know what he’s doing, then maybe it’s not rape. Kinda tricky.

    It’s kinda like asking, “if a serial killer is seriously mentally ill and doesn’t know what he’s doing, is he guilty of being charged?” Hard to say.

    Anyways, interesting set of questions, I wonder which show you’re watching PD.. 🙂 later xo

    Liked by 1 person

    • Psy you hit the core issue I have on the head – if the guy was also extremely intoxicated and nobody remembers what happened and nobody saw them, well, then what?

      The show is Switched At Birth – mid season 4 is when it comes up.

      Liked by 1 person

  6. I’m totally going to filter this through my own experience, but here goes: I’m firmly of the belief that you can’t give genuine consent when you’re drunk, and also that being drunk is not a reasonable excuse for not understanding a “no”.

    Maybe, just maybe, I’d be closer to believing it’s not rape if the woman seemed to give an enthusiastic yes and the SOLE factor leading you say it’s not consensual was that she was drunk. But how often is this really all there is to it?

    Is this a guy in whom the woman has ever expressed a genuine romantic or sexual interest before, or is he suddenly thinking he can’t believe his “luck” and deliberately ignoring the possibility that the woman’s capacity to consent is impaired? Does he ignore or push boundaries in other contexts? Is there any sense that he feels he is “owed” sex, eg in return for drinks, meals, rides etc? is there a power differential? Is he respectful of the woman afterwards – does he act like this was a joint error of judgement or treat her like a slut?

    Basically, I’d be asking myself if the sum total of how the guy normally acts and whether his actions before, during and after the drunken sex this time seem consistent with a genuine belief that this was consensual, lead you to give him the benefit of the doubt.

    I think in the vast majority of situations where it seems like rape, or the woman feels like it was, when you look at it closely there actually were a whole heap of little no’s which were expressed all along, but we’ve been socialised so well to not see these as “real”. Rape culture in a nutshell.

    But being able to have society and the law back you up on any of this is a whole other story.

    Liked by 3 people

    • Thank you for all of this. I think the part of what you said that most resonated was “there actually were a whole heap of little no’s which were expressed all along but we’ve been socialized so well to not see those as ‘real'”.

      Essentially I was watching this TV show and they did a really good job about addressing the complexity of it but actually sent me spiralling back to a night in college where I could have been that girl, leading me to ask myself if I was assaulted? I don’t know the answer, really. But your explanation did help so much.

      Liked by 1 person

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